Building a Predictable Revenue Engine With Melissa Martin

Intro: 00:00   

Welcome back to the Response Drivers podcast, where we feature top marketing minds and dig in to their inspiring stories. Learn how these leaders think and find big ideas to push your results and sales to the next level. Now let’s get started.

Rick Rappe  00:19  

Hey, I’m Rick Rappe, host of the Response Drivers podcast. Here I dive deep with marketing experts and innovators to learn how they approach targeted marketing and use data driven strategies to acquire and retain customers. We’ll talk about what’s working, what’s changing, and how we can stay ahead in an evolving marketing landscape. 

Response Drivers is brought to you by RPM Direct Marketing. RPM helps companies develop hard hitting, direct mail creative and utilize advanced testing and targeting methodologies to reach customers and prospects.Our goal is to fully optimize your direct mail marketing performance and drive more sales to and exceed growth expectations. Check out rpmdm.com to learn more. 

Today’s guest is someone I’m really excited to bring on. Melissa Martin is a revenue growth strategist, speaker, and Founder of Blackwood Impact Group, a fractional chief revenue officer consultancy that helps service based small businesses and nonprofits scale without the chaos. 

With a background in sales, marketing and revenue operations, Melissa is known for transforming scattered marketing efforts into streamlined systems that generate predictable revenue. She combines StoryBrand messaging with her proprietary, Predictable revenue engine framework to unlock client growth. Melissa has been a featured speaker at events like Mom 2.0 summit, and has been published in outlets such as LA Weekly and Men’s Journal. Thanks for joining me today, Melissa.

Melissa Martin  01:50  

You are welcome. Thank you for having me. Rick.

Rick Rappe  01:53  

Can you share a little bit more about your journey into the world of marketing and revenue growth?

Melissa Martin  01:58  

Yes. it has always been. I’ve always been doing marketing, so I. Quick backstory I started out in sports marketing and promotions, and I quickly realized the way that I wanted to live my life. That was not going to be conducive to the term when we try to get work life balance.

So anytime you work in I worked in baseball, hockey and any sport you’re in, you got to think you’re going to be working some type of major holiday. You work days like a 9 to 5, and then you’re there at the game all night. So it was just a lot. But I never let my I didn’t lose the passion for marketing. I just did an early pivot in my career and I found digital marketing. 

And so once I pivoted from sports to digital, it just all made sense. I did that in the era when SEO search engine optimization was a new thing. And so once I started doing that, I became I was in sales inside of digital marketing agencies. So having the marketing background and the marketing degree, my undergrad was in business administration with a concentration in marketing. And I was a marketing major who said, I’ll never go into sales. 

But, you know, here, there I was here and it clicked, I loved it. I got the best of both worlds. So I was doing consultative sales within digital marketing agencies, and I just saw firsthand having to talk to the prospect about what’s going on in their business the ins, the outs, the personal, the personal pains, the business pains, and then match that to the solution to solve that was the best thing that could have ever happened in my career and really, you know, led me to where I am today. So to bridge that gap from when I first started being in sales within digital marketing agencies to founding Blackwood Impact Group, I was noticing a common denominator, Rick, which was a lot of people wanted the marketing creativity and the sexiness of it. You know, I need social media. 

I need to do this. I need to do that. But their business wasn’t positioned properly. The brand message was a little bit off and they didn’t have the right strategy. Now, you know, 22 year old Melissa, you know, 23, 24, 25 I didn’t know that that what it was essentially. 

But as I grew in the career developed and was curious to learn more like why is there what is this disconnect? It led me to realizing those things and offering better solutions and services to the to those clients.

Rick Rappe  05:04  

That makes great sense. Were there any pivotal moments in your early career that really shaped your approach?

Melissa Martin  05:11  

Yes, there were two. I stumbled upon. I’m an avid reader and I don’t read a lot of nonfiction. You know, don’t don’t stone me. I don’t realize I don’t read a lot of I should say, I don’t read a lot of fiction.

Excuse me? I don’t read a lot of fiction. I read I love to read business books. So I have a few, you know, behind me. And things changed when I read Donald Miller’s book Building a StoryBrand 

And it just it helped answer the questions that were in the back of my head or the thoughts that I was having again, like, why is there this disconnect? What is really going go what what doesn’t make campaigns as successful as they could be, and a lot of it was dialing. Going back to the messaging and the positioning and how you are really relating to your relating and talking to your audience and your customer. And it was like I read it and I was just every page like, yes. Oh my gosh. 

I think the same thing. I feel the same way. And oh that’s interesting. Let me, let me learn more. And it just put me down a rabbit hole into not just marketing and sales, but really getting heavily heavier into the brand messaging and storytelling. 

So that was very that was pivotal. It just helped connect the dots. It’s like a lot of times I feel like we know certain things or we get certain hunches. Our intuition is telling us things. You know, that gut feeling of this is what we should be doing or something is wrong. 

And then you hear something. You have a conversation, you read something, and it just helps everything click and you. And then I was like off to the races for just building off of that methodology and the frameworks and the principle and yeah, that that was a key. That was a key moment. And then also a second moment that really changed my mindset to after getting into being sales of digital Marketing Agency, a partner in my a partner and I co-founded another digital marketing agency. 

And so I was head of sales within that bootstrapped it. No, we didn’t have any funding, any grants, anything of that nature, just straight up networking, cold calling, boots, boots on the ground, all that. And we built that up and we sold it in 20 2017. And after that, he and I both started consulting, just doing projects for doing projects within other within other advertising agencies. And so as I was going through and helping them set up their their sales infrastructure to better sell the digital marketing, the digital marketing services, putting in, putting all that together for them, I was also selling for them as well at the same time. 

So it was like kind of like being a fractional, you know, sales officer and, and all that. And I remember going on a lot of calls and hearing these small business owners, they’re so good at what they do, but they’re stuck and they don’t again, that the adults saying, you know, you don’t know what you don’t know, being across from them and hearing them say, talk about their struggles, what they need to do, they’re spending a lot of money on marketing. And it’s not sticking and knowing that they’re about to. They’re getting ready to either pay for a lot of things that they don’t necessarily need, or they’ve paid for things that they that they didn’t need or going in the wrong order of doing things. And I was just like, I can help you. 

Like I can help you with that. Before even spending a ton of money on ads, before spending a ton of money on a new website. You there’s so there’s something missing. And I saw that also in the marketplace that that wasn’t really readily available for smaller businesses. And it just clicked like I, I thought that I had to I always knew that I wanted to consult. 

I knew that I wanted to coach and do the things that I’m doing now. But Rick, I thought that I had to have, you know, pepper gray hair. I thought I had to be at IBM for 20 years. I thought I had to do all the things that made you a quote unquote, consultant. But in that meeting, I’ll never forget the gentleman. 

I knew that there’s some things that you’re missing. There’s a gap between where you are and you really going to market and doing all the nice and shiny things that I would love to help you with and, and in return save you a lot of money, headache and heartache in the in the meantime.

Rick Rappe  10:07  

So and that’s what led you to found the The Blackwood Impact Group?

Melissa Martin  10:12  

Yes.

Rick Rappe  10:13  

That makes sense. Wow. As a small business owner, that resonates with me a lot. I know we’re we’re good at marketing for our clients and at doing our direct mail. We’re very focused on direct mail marketing, but I think we need help with our own marketing more often than not.

It’s it’s an interesting thing.

Melissa Martin  10:33  

It is. We can talk about I have a laundry list of content I want to create and things I want to do, but I’m like, I got I have to do it for my clients first.

Rick Rappe  10:42  

Yeah, exactly. We always prioritize our clients project work, and then we’re the last people in line for our own.

Melissa Martin  10:51  

I keep saying, I keep saying, I have this joke like I’m gonna be. I’m gonna be my own best case study. Like one of these days. Like, hopefully, if not this year, next year. I’m saying I’m putting it out there from from my mouth to to your ears that I really would love to be my my own best case study.

Rick Rappe  11:10  

So, yeah. What’s your predictable revenue engine framework, and how does that help businesses scale without the chaos?

Melissa Martin  11:20  

I came to developing this over the years of, again, just simply listening to the gaps that these that these founders, business owners and nonprofits were going through. And so the full, predictable revenue engine, to be honest, it takes time. Like it’s a it’s a process that we work through that is not a overnight. That’s not a overnight type of of process. It’s a 12 month program that me and my clients go through, and it’s divided up into three parts.

So the first we call it setting the strategy. The second is building the system. And third is when you can actually scale for success. So in the first three months of us working together, we start with the foundation. So this is a little bit of a different take on your mission vision values. 

But essentially what we’re doing is we start with getting clear on your revenue goals. So regardless of you know, what you think you want, what you you say, oh, I want to you might want to double your revenue or you want to make you want to hit seven figures. Okay. Cool. Great. 

Love that. What is it going to take to get there? What do you need to sell? What products do you need to be in place? What is that that buyer’s journey. 

So we’re really being strategic behind you. Say you want this. You say you want x, Y and Z. Well, what we we take that goal and then we work backwards. So after we have the the goal set in place, then we match the we create the messaging for you to actually go after that goal in the marketplace and the positioning. 

So again a lot of strategy work. And then once we have that in place now we can actually start to what I call build the system. So that’s your lead generation your website your sales process and funnels. So now we go from just the verbal guidelines and the strategy onto. Now we can we can start to to make it sexy now like you can start to see okay, now that I’ve mastered answering the question, you know, what do I do more powerfully now that I have my pitch together? 

Now let’s turn that into now we get into more of the creative and the visual aspect going to market, right? And then at the end. So once now we’re up in live and running okay. We now we have to we’ve built this system. Now we have to invite people in. 

So that’s where we start to run campaigns. That’s when we start to really ramp up your content marketing, how you’re showing up in the marketplace and then building the the systems and procedures. So you can either now you’re getting to the point where it’s up and running. You can either start to consider hiring internally or outsourcing building your team, building the scope out which I help manage that until you can either replace me or or just have it, you know, running on its own. So I this whole process, I’m acting as your fractional chief revenue officer to build the line, the brand, the sales and the marketing so that you are at the end of the 12 months, you’re in a position to generate that predictable, consistent revenue month in and month out because your leads are coming in. 

Your messaging is Trump type, and now you’re just as it says, you are generating predictable revenue and you can grow and scale.

Rick Rappe  15:15  

Yeah, sounds like a great process.

Melissa Martin  15:18  

Yeah. It’s fun. You gotta you gotta you gotta be in it, people. You have to be realistic on how long these things really take to do and work through and to do it right. Of course, I have different offers that you can do things very quickly in a matter of weeks and what what have you.

But to really do the full process of building a proper foundation within your business, within your organization, you have to take the time to do things right, to build it out, build the systems so that they run smoothly, well into the future.

Rick Rappe  15:53  

Yeah. And it’s particularly difficult for small businesses to do. Right, because they’re not able to dedicate 100% of their time to marketing. So this is this is something that it takes time and, you know, you have to do it around other things. Yeah, you’ve touched on this already, but I’ll ask the question and see if there’s anything else you would want to mention.

What are common mistakes that businesses make in their marketing efforts and how can they avoid them? I mean, you touched on already the fact that a lot of people jump into marketing execution without having the right foundation. Is there anything else that comes to mind when you think of like, common mistakes that people make?

Melissa Martin  16:33  

Yes. A lot of it, I think, is we I feel like we live in a time, and we’ve been living in a time where. It’s it’s glorified to take action and to have a lot of. What is it they call I think like acting fast, you know, making decisions quick, a bias towards action, which I do believe in. But you have to find the sweet spot between strategy, making sure what you’re doing is the right move and and then making that move.

I think a lot of times I’m seeing my prospects, clients, they move too quickly without doing things in the proper order. And again, you don’t know what you don’t know, but just a simple example is you going to create a website or run spend thousands of dollars on ads, but you you you’re not. When the people click on the on the ad, they go to a jacked up sales page or you’re not really telling them the the proper next steps. There’s just missing pieces in the marketing puzzle. They might have all the pieces, but it’s not making a cohesive picture. 

So that’s that’s confusing marketing activity. It basically you’re confusing marketing activity with actual strategy. Another thing I would say operating again without the clear messaging or a working sales funnel. So you don’t have the the message to get people’s attention, to answer all the questions in their mind of who you are. Is this for me? 

Is this going to solve my problem? Is this too hard for me? Like, you know, addressing the objections that they have in their mind and a part of the next step of that would be you’re not you don’t have a clear process to move people from. They don’t know you to. They’re ready to buy. 

Yeah. And I would say the third common mistake would be hiring too soon or hiring too soon internally, or outsourcing outsourcing without a system in place. So a lot of times, and I’ve seen this with unfortunately a lot of marketing agencies, I feel get a bad rep sometimes, or even freelancers like I hired them and they didn’t do anything for me or x, y, x, y or z. And it’s a lot of times you’re hiring a designer or a or a marketer that that’s just what they do. They might not have the the aptitude for business. 

Business operations, positioning, so on and so forth. So you’re coming to them saying, hey, can you make this, this mud pie taste like a, a wedding cake? You know what I mean? No, that was the best thing. But I think about the term help me help you. 

So even before I just recently hired a not got an intern, and I wanted to make sure everything was set up in place for me. Excuse me? Me to be able to, you know, nurture, guide. Give them what they needed so that they can in return, help me. I think that’s that’s something that’s missing. 

We we kind of from from a small business perspective. Again your go go go do do do. Yeah. And you haven’t set up the things internally to to equip the, the new hire or the freelancer or outsource agency.

Rick Rappe  20:10  

Well a lot of times small business owners and and leaders, small business leaders have to they wear so many different hats, they think, well, I’ll just put on the marketing hat and it’s like, yeah, it’s a little more complicated than just pretending like, you know what to do in terms of marketing and starting to hire people. It sounds like your sales background also really helps you to kind of bridge the gap between marketing and sales. I think that that ability to think and understand a lead comes in and then what what happens, how how are we going to convert that lead? How does it go through the pipeline? And what are the what are the points that we need to get people to go to.

You know, so many people try to like, close the sale immediately and don’t really step people through a good process. So that makes a lot of sense. How do you use data to inform marketing strategies and produce better outcomes?

Melissa Martin  21:06  

Well, it depends on what type of platform you’re using. So of course, when we’re looking at ads running digital ads, for example, on Facebook and across social media or pay per click, something that I like to pay attention and my team like to pay attention to the most is what is the click through rate and of course, what the client, how many, how many. Not just impressions, but how many people, once they see the ad are clicking onto the page and then once they’re on the page, how many have opted in to either learn more, book the call, schedule the consultation, download the form, so on and so forth. And then that’s kind of in my marketing hat. That’s really our, that’s that’s our job.

But but I know that clients, they want to look at the actual close rate. So but again that kind of falls on them. So I try again from what I do, I try to help equip my clients with the tools that they need to actually close. But you know, but those are the metrics that we’re looking at click through rates. We’re also looking at how many how many people are opening your emails. 

What’s the rate that they’re that they are opting out? You have to be aware of those things is and I kind of want to touch on the whole people, you know, disengaging with you on email and things like that, or are opting out of your ecosystem. That’s not always a bad thing. You know, you are not for everyone. I think that’s that’s something that I. 

I want more businesses to be okay with. You know, you’re not for everyone. And maybe that just means you are speaking to the right people. Like the right people are going to stay. They’re going to want what you have. 

You can’t always speak to everyone, and everyone isn’t going to.

Rick Rappe  23:07  

Right.

Melissa Martin  23:08  

Want want your thing. But as long as you’re being specific and you’re planning your flag and where you stand, what you do, how you help, what the outcome is, you’re going to attract your right people.

Rick Rappe  23:19  

Yeah. As long as you have a really clear understanding of who your ideal customer is and what their needs are, and you’re speaking to those needs and making sure that your messaging is resonating with those people, then, you know, you do have to cast a broader net, a wider net, and, you know, talk to more people to find the ones that are are in your ideal customer profile and have the problem. What resources or practices do you rely on to stay updated and continuously improve your strategies?

Melissa Martin  23:53  

Great question. Love this. So as I mentioned earlier, I believe Avid Reader. I have my key people that I in the industry that I tune into, that I learn from, that give me moments again. Donald Miller.

A huge one, obviously. I’m a Storybrand certified guide. So I drank the Kool-Aid. I drank the Kool-Aid before I even knew I could be become a guide. So he he’s he’s up there that I learned from. 

I learn a lot from also people’s stories and what they’ve gone through and what they share. Jenna Kutcher is good at that. Amy Porterfield, these are what we are now calling, you know, your business and marketing influencers Just learning their story. Hearing about their stories. Learning from what they’ve tried and what’s gone wrong. 

I’m a firm believer in I want to be wise in business. I want to be wise in life. I want to be wise in business. And if someone else has made the mistake, I’m going to listen. I’m going to listen. 

But you know, but to get back to your To Your Question podcast, I learned a lot from podcasts. I learned a lot from conferences and summits. Another great, great conference, and that I attended and want to frequent is I believe it’s Joe Pulizzi Joe Pulizzi. He has. I think it’s like Content Inc is a book that he has, and he puts on a on a wonderful conference and summit in Cleveland. 

And I think it’s content marketing, just Joe Pulizzi. But he’s awesome. I think a true like old school pioneer. In the content marketing game, who else? Chris Do in terms of branding and creative and design. 

So even though I preach a lot about messaging and getting your words right, I do respect deeply the design and creative aspect in that regard. So I try to make sure I tune in to the the leaders and the teachings of that as well, so that I can make sure I’m blending, making sure messaging and design still are cohesive. And and I would probably say lastly, Kelly Roach Kelly Roach is an awesome teacher. Content creator has a lot of great things to share, but that, you know, going. Sometimes I go back through my old MBA books. 

 I spent so much money on the degree, I might as well make sure I remember what we did.

Rick Rappe  26:45  

We wrote the books and who they mentioned. Yeah.

Melissa Martin  26:47  

Right. And just going going back to that. But that’s how that’s really, you know, and, and the best lessons are just through, through doing I, II trial and error in my own business. Yeah I before I, before I before I recommend any vendors or freelancers designers web developers I to my clients I, I use them myself. So it’s just keeping up with the industry news podcasts, books, conferences and and just continuing to to test on my own test on Blackwood.

Rick Rappe  27:25  

How do you see the marketing landscape evolving in the next few years? What do you think businesses need to do to stay ahead of the evolving landscape?

Melissa Martin  27:35  

Become become friends with AI?

Rick Rappe  27:38  

Yeah.

Melissa Martin  27:39  

I think we’ve we.

Rick Rappe  27:41  

Have to touch on AI, of course, because it’s such a big it’s going to have such a big impact on our world, right?

Melissa Martin  27:47  

Oh my God. Especially from a marketing perspective. Yeah. From a marketing perspective. Content creation, distribution.

You know, I laugh sometimes. I think literally yesterday I was like, Thank God for ChatGPT. Like, I’m just I’m sitting here talking to it. I turned it into my my business advisor, my therapist like you. I’m not even joking. 

But, you know, I would just say become friends with AI. If you if you haven’t already, there’s tons of free courses from wonderful institutions that you can take to learn about it. See how and first, if you’re leery about it, I would just say learn how to use it to offload some tasks. So before I hired a virtual assistant, I. I said, let me see what I, what I, what can I automate? 

What can I use AI for? Because that’s going to save you time and money in your business. So I think that’s going to I think in terms of the industry, we’re going to see things going to market quicker because of the use of these types of tools. So again, you still want to have the strategy. You need to know the prompts and whatnot. 

But if you’re when you’re an expert at something and which we all are in our own right and in some way, shape or form, figure out how to use AI to just accelerate and put those certain things on autopilot so that you can grow your business more efficiently and effectively. I also think that some changes are going to be. Diving deeper into the the personal brand, tapping into that to then to create communities that are back in person. So I think more live events blending your if you’re a coach or consultant, blending your offers with more in-person because again you gotta offset if things are going like super I and we don’t know what’s real and what’s fake. And, you know, people might think you’re creating content. 

They might think you’re an AI generated talking head. It’s like, no, I’m real. Let’s get together. Let’s still have community. Let’s still have this sense of like realness and authenticity. 

I think that’s gonna be that’s gonna help you stand apart. And also with what you do with the the direct mail, you we’re going to have to go back, so to speak, to the more traditional pieces to stand out, because if not even if online is saturated like crazy, like I don’t I wish I knew the stats on how many posts are done on Facebook and Instagram and LinkedIn and all that, and it’s like for you to hold something tangible, feel it in your hands. A marketing material that is going to leave a longer lasting impression than something you’re seeing on your on your screen. So, you know, you gotta, you know, do do some things, you know.

Rick Rappe  31:06  

You can sell. You can sell for us anytime. That’s exactly part of our sales pitch, of course, because, you know, we we talk about the the fragmentation of the digital audience and how fragmented it is. So it’s harder to reach your target market sometimes with digital marketing as opposed to direct mail. Everybody’s got a mailbox.

So we can we can hit the the world in a and with a lot of data and a lot of precision in our targeting. But yeah, we we also talk about the there’s a crisis of trust happening with a lot of parts of digital marketing, right? So that’s another issue that direct mail can help overcome because it’s it’s actually a more trusted and and yeah, when people touch a physical direct mail piece, they found that it actually lights up a whole different area of your brain really compared to seeing something on screen. It’s a completely different thing that happens in our in our heads, which I think is really interesting.

Melissa Martin  32:08  

So that’s so cool. Yeah, I love psychology. If I could have minored, it would have been in psychology.

Rick Rappe  32:15  

Yeah, yeah. We all have to study a lot of psychology and marketing and understand what’s happening in people’s minds with our messages and with our content and all these things.

Melissa Martin  32:26  

Yeah.

Rick Rappe  32:27  

Well, we’ve covered a lot of ground today. Thank you so much. This has been really helpful. I’ll ask you one more question before we wrap up. Is there a widely accepted marketing practice that you believe is overrated or due for a rethink.

Melissa Martin  32:43  

I think I just go back to. It might not be one specific thing. My soapbox is get your foundation right. Yeah. And Melissa, what is what is your foundation?

It’s the things that we’ve been talking about. You’re messaging your how you how you simply answer the question, what do you do that is so powerful? If you answer that question wrong, you are leaving so much money on the table if it’s not effective. So if you don’t have a good grasp on what you do, the problem that you solve, and the solution and transformation that that that means for your ideal customer, that is, that is is so underrated. And then really the what you’re offering your product or your service Getting that right. 

So when I say foundational pieces, knowing where you’re going, you say you want to be a seven, seven, eight figure, all all these things. But why and how? What is it going to take to get there? So getting very clear on the foundations of your business and before, yes, before you go to the before you’re hopping on every trend. You know, don’t get me wrong, if you want to dance on TikTok, that’s fine. 

You know, there’s some really good dancers out there if you want to, you know, if you want to, to do all those things, that’s awesome. Just make sure before you hop on the next shiny new thing you are, you have your message, right? You have a solid marketing strategy in place, and you know exactly how you’re going to move. Move your ideal customer or client from them, not knowing who you are to them saying yes, you know that. Get your foundation right in your business and then trust me, when you have the time and the budget, it will be so much easier for you to see results doing all the nice and shiny things and being on multiple platforms, doing all the different types of tactics.

Rick Rappe  35:02  

Yeah, we totally see this in our business all the time because we’re we’re producing and creating direct mail, but our clients that have a really strong, solid brand foundation, we leverage that and use that in our direct mail. And it makes our job so much easier to have that solid foundation to base things on when they’ve done the research on what does the market need and how do we speak to those needs. It makes executing really great direct mail much, much easier. Of course, we do a lot of testing and optimization and things like that that it takes to make direct mail really work well. But that foundation is critical.

Absolutely. Well, thank you so much for covering all this with us today. For listeners that are interested in learning more about your work or the predictable revenue engine, where can they find more information?

Melissa Martin  36:00  

Yes. So thank you for asking. You can find us at our website. Blackwood impact group.com. Very active on Instagram and LinkedIn.

And we also through all the different platforms, whether it be a link in bio. Probably one of my most recent posts. I have a call to action to to take our customer catch quiz. And so if anything has resonated with you throughout this conversation in terms of I’m wondering why I’m not seeing a return on my marketing, I wonder where I’m falling short? Am I not attracting the people? 

is are they not converting? Where am I losing them in the process? The Customer Cash quiz helps you define that, and it’s a custom output to to everyone who uses it. And then at the end of it, I offer a free consultation to have a 30 minute conversation with me about the results from your quiz, and help you guide your next best steps for closing the gaps in your sales funnel.

Rick Rappe  37:07  

That sounds like a really great opportunity for a lot of small businesses to get a little bit of free advice from you and learn more about your approach. Yeah, I might have to get on there and do it myself, I think.

Melissa Martin  37:20  

Please do. It’s really cool and it’s engaging. It’s a video. I sat there and did each question as a video. So I’m going to read you.

Yeah, it’s pretty cool. It’s pretty cool. It’s free plug. It’s called interface.io. And so it’s a wonderful lead magnet. 

So if you’re if any anyone’s out there looking to have a different spin, more unique spin on your lead magnet and your quizzes or assessments, do a video, do a video quiz or assessment.

Rick Rappe  37:51  

Wow, I really need to check that out for RPM as well. So thank you for that advice.

Melissa Martin  37:57  

You’re welcome.

Rick Rappe  37:57  

Well, thank you so much for your time today. It’s been a real pleasure getting to know you, and I appreciate your time. And we’ll talk to you again soon. Maybe we’ll see you at that conference.

Melissa Martin  38:07  

Yes, yes, we’ll keep in touch. Thanks, Rick.

Outro: 38:11   

That’s a wrap for this episode of Response Drivers. Thanks for tuning in. If you found today’s insights valuable, make sure to subscribe so you never miss an episode. And if you’re enjoying the show, we’d love it if you left a review, got a question or a topic you’d like us to cover? Just drop us a message at responsedrivers@rpmdm.com until next time, keep driving response and making your marketing work smarter.